Jeremy Zucker and Chelsea Cutler Chat About "Brent iii" and A-Frame Cabins

*Originally published 12/12/24

When it comes to songwriters that truly speak to me, Jeremy Zucker and Chelsea Cutler have been at the top of that list for years. They're on their third collaborative Brent project, and this one is as well-crafted as ever. Their knack for beautiful vulnerability has left me and others in tears far too many times, and Brent iii has been another wonderful iteration of that. Through lyrics that hit close to home and melodies that feel like a warm hug, the duo has been taking the world by storm.

You've been making music together for quite some time now. Do you think maintaining a healthy friendship is an important part of your music making process, and how do you inspire each other?

Chelsea: I think that healthy friendship is really, really important to being able to collaborate well together. I think that we both have to, you know, be comfortable enough to be vulnerable with each other in our conversation and our songwriting. Making art is inherently a pretty vulnerable thing to do. It requires comfort and vulnerability to disagree or work through things. Not that we ever have conflicts or anything, but, when you're working with other people there are a lot of opinions and a lot of ideas that are brought to the table. So I think having a healthy friendship is really important to being able to sort through that and compromise in some areas and just try to support each other in others.

Jeremy: I would say it's especially important, when we push each other. And Chelsea and I know each other so well. We're pretty comfortable being really frank and honest, where if we were working with someone we didn't know really well, it's a lot harder to be honest and to be nice. And I just think we have each other's boundaries pretty locked in. We know when to give each other space.

Do you guys write these lyrics based on your love of your friendship or personal love experiences?

Jeremy: It's definitely our individual experiences outside of our friendship. Usually, it's romantic love, and we really vent to each other about things that are going on in our lives individually. So the songwriting process is kind of, I would say, partially therapizing. If one of us is singing or writing about this really specific thing, the other one is there to help get it out of them and support them and translate it into a song, vice versa. But oftentimes, we each kind of have our own perspective on a song that we're writing about, and we're able to put it together in a way that we're writing about different things, but it feels like it's about something.

How did you decide on the album's lead singles “A-frame” and “black & white”? And what do these songs represent in the context of the entire album?

Chelsea: It's so funny how "black & white" even came into the mix. I know we knew we loved "A-frame" from the get go, that was a standout kinda from the day that we wrote it since it's upbeat and feel good. We wrote the song in an a-frame, and you can really hear that in how big and boomy the song is. So I think we loved "A-frame" for a multitude of reasons, and "black & white" was actually one of the last songs to get tacked on to the project. A week before Brent iii was due, Jeremy actually circled back on it and was like, "I really like the song."I don't know. How did we even decide that should be a single?

Jeremy: It was just one of the last ones we were working on, and it felt like the last piece of the puzzle. We were all really excited about that. It's really nice and wholesome and approachable and just felt like a really good introduction to this extension of the world that we created. And then "A-frame," I just felt like that was an obvious banger. We wanted to get people excited and warm everyone up with "black & white" and then smack them in the face with "A-frame."

Given that so many fans see Brent as a safe space to deal with emotional topics, was there anything specific about this album that you were hoping would offer them? A sense of comfort or a new perspective?

Jeremy: There's definitely some specific stories on here. So I guess it would really relate to someone that is dealing with the hyper-specific issues that we talk about on a couple songs, like "ashes & rust," about transgenerational trauma. And "and the government too!" is about a long distance intercontinental relationship. But there's also a couple just really general, relatable, across the board songs. "Black & white," was written about loving being on tour and being thankful to the fans, but I think it really comes across also as, just a genuine appreciation and love song. There's a lot of perspectives that you can pull from it, and I think this is definitely no exception in terms of how well people can connect to it.

Chelsea: I probably overplay this card a bit, but I do think the fact that we're able to make music so earnestly together as friends definitely helps us make music that other people can find a lot of solace and comfort in. And I don't know. We always kinda sit in the studio and say we want the record to feel like a cozy, safe place for people.

You guys have had a long history of collaboration. Do you both have a favorite song from your collaborations, and what makes it special to you?

Chelsea: I love so many, so it's hard. I feel like the obvious answer would be "you were good to me" just because it's the first song we made for a Brent project. It totally started this whole trajectory of everything that Brent became. I feel very indebted to that song for that. But I do feel really proud and excited about so many songs we've made.

Jeremy: I agree with Chelsea, "you were good to me." It's just really special, and I think the fact that it was the beginning also makes it feel a lot more special. But I really just think it's a perfect song in the sense that it's so untraditional, but so beautiful, and so accessible as well. We'll never make a song as good as that ever again. I'm just kidding. Maybe we will. Who knows?

You described in a short video that "A-frame" was inspired by the acoustics of a cabin you were staying in. Were any other songs on the record inspired by these similar soundscapes and surroundings? And if so, which ones and how so?

Chelsea: Wait, Jerm, in that song do you have the birds from outside of your garage? Is that "terrible things"?

Jeremy: Oh, yeah, that was "terrible things." But I was gonna say "government" as well. Chelsea, you have a good anecdote about us writing that song and the feelings in the room and the cabin.

Chelsea: We wrote that and "government too" in the same cabin that we did "A-frame," but it was the first night that we got there. A beautiful thing about our friendship is that we're not just getting in the studio for a few hours. When we go to make Brent projects, we typically travel together, and we'll stay somewhere for a few days together. And, yeah, we're in a cute little a-frame in Big Bear, California, and it was January and freezing. I think we had a fire going. It was just it was so cozy and beautiful which definitely got us in our feels pretty quickly. There was palpable magic when we sat down to to start "and the government too!"

What themes or stories did you aim to convey and bring free that differ from the first two projects? How would you say the storyline or emotional arc has shifted?

Chelsea: I would say maybe the largest the largest difference in our writing or storytelling is that we're more mature and able to write about more complex and nuanced emotions. We're a few years older and going through more complex stuff in life. So naturally, we kind of write about more specific things. The older you get, the more complex your emotions get.

If you could pick one lyric from Brent iii that resonates with you the most, which would it be and why?

Chelsea: I think that "and the government too!" has such a special place in my heart just because I really just loved that moment of realness when when we kind of decided to say it and not be so romantic and and poetic with it. So maybe... "I'd scream at the stars for keeping us apart" in "the government too." It's just such a privilege to get to write alongside your friend.

Jeremy:  I think that the second verse of "and the government too!" speaks to me personally. The whole song definitely does, But, the second verse particularly, "Did you know that the continent's sliding? /  In ten million years, we're colliding / At least we won't have to be flying." Especially the part that's, like, "Isn't it nice to imagine? / In twenty years, we'll all be laughing / And one of our kids will be asking / Since you both made all this happen / How does it feel to just know?" I think the idea of imagining that in the future, this is just a funny story that you get to tell your kids is a really light and beautiful way to talk about or to to view a problem in the present.

It was such an honor to hear so many great questions and answers, and it was difficult to choose my favorites, but these answers truly represent the forces behind the Brent projects. Jeremy and Chelsea's openness was deeply appreciated and inspiring to hear as a young person growing up in a confusing world. Brent iii is available on all streaming platforms now!